Episode 1: Indiana's $25M Employer Lifeline - A Big Boost for Employer Childcare

Just two dads talking childcare tax credits. Free money for employers in Indiana!

Welcome to the inaugural episode of the "Tax Break Breakdown" podcast, hosted by Greg and Doug! Tailored for HR and operations teams in enterprises, this episode serves as a comprehensive guide to navigating childcare benefits and tax breaks.

Dive into the world of childcare benefits as Greg and Doug passionately discuss the significance of saving money through tax breaks. They shine a spotlight on Indiana's childcare benefit program, a game-changer that offers grants to employers, empowering them to support their employees' childcare needs.

The hosts dissect the eligibility criteria and allowable expenses, providing valuable insights into the program's potential impact. They also explore the intriguing TriShare program and the evolving landscape of childcare benefits.

Get a step-by-step walkthrough of the application process for Indiana's childcare benefit program. The duo breaks down the importance of a well-crafted project plan and accurate estimates, highlighting the cost-sharing requirements and the timeline for fund utilization.

The episode further delves into the nuances of letters of support, stressing their optional yet advantageous role. Greg and Doug demystify the review and submission process, reassuring listeners with the availability of resources and support.

Wrapping up, the hosts recap the Indiana program's potential benefits and address frequently asked questions. They leave no stone unturned, covering eligibility criteria and tax implications.

Tune in for an enlightening and practical discussion, designed to empower HR and operations teams with the knowledge to maximize childcare benefits and tax breaks!

Disclaimer: This podcast is for informational purposes only and shouldn't be seen as financial or legal advice. Tax rules change and can be complex, so it's always a good idea to check with a professional for your specific needs. Frankly, we're just two dads talking childcare tax credits for employers who want to see more employers leverage these resources.

Chapters

• 0:00 Introduction and Purpose
• 0:29 Why We're Doing This
• 3:12 Overview of Indiana's Childcare Benefit Program
• 6:20 Details of Indiana's Childcare Benefit Program
• 8:19 TriShare Programs and Future of Childcare Benefits
• 29:13 Application Process for Indiana's Childcare Benefit Program
• 39:03 Application Process and Project Plan
• 39:30 Cost Sharing and Timeframe
• 40:10 Letters of Support and Terms
• 40:38 Review and Submission
• 41:12 Resources and Support
• 41:22 Summary and Wrap-up
• 42:58 FAQs and Eligibility
• 43:32 Criteria for Review
• 43:54 Spending and Tax Implications

Transcript

Doug (00:02.962)
Hahaha

Greg (00:05.367)
Well, here we go. This is episode one. Welcome to the tax break breakdown with your hosts Greg and Doug. This is exciting Doug. This is our first episode. One of many. I think there's a ton of topics that we're going to be able to cover. I think that's going to be cool.

Doug (00:10.109)
Thank you.

Doug (00:17.745)
It is.

Doug (00:22.481)
We hope.

Greg (00:29.218)
For the first episode, it's probably important that we talk about why we're doing this. From Doug and I's perspective, we are both tech entrepreneurs in SaaS, working in the childcare space and the childcare industry. I think more important though, Doug and I are very, very similar. We're not gonna get into all of it, right?

Doug (00:34.265)
Yeah, I think that probably is important.

Greg (00:57.746)
There's probably so many, we'll lead it for everybody. And I think though, one of the main things that we have in common is we love to save money. We love to see where the loopholes are and how do we actually like take advantage of what's actually out there. And I think when you look at, at least in the child kinder, see which we both work in,

Doug (00:58.83)
We gotta yeah, it's there's a lot of synergy here. Yeah

Greg (01:26.466)
There's 21 states that have tax credit programs. But I think everybody knows just how complicated they are. You've read some, I've read some. It's insane how they put this together and the restrictions.

But the money is there. You just have to know how to get to it. And so our goal for this is really, we want HR teams, operations teams, companies that are looking to add a childcare benefit, they're exploring it, to just know that these dollars are out there and maybe provide ways for people to get access to them.

Doug (02:01.661)
Yeah, there's a lot of hope that's out there. Getting it is difficult, as you said, like most of the time, and not just the organizations, but the families as well. Like we're dads, we have children that have child care. We incur that expense, we have to deal with it when people get sick, and it affects all industries.

Greg (02:18.794)
Yep.

Doug (02:22.405)
I would say we're probably pretty fortunate, but there's a lot of industries out there where frontline workers don't always have the same flexibility that we do working in the tech space. And this is where I think it can make such a big impact, especially in industries that, you know, maybe it's a little bit more of a hurdle to get over to get something in place.

Greg (02:39.294)
Yeah. So this being our first episode, how do you see this playing out for our listeners? Yeah.

Doug (02:40.649)
Yeah.

Doug (02:47.793)
Well, I know we have a really exciting program to talk about tonight, right? In a state that's dear to my heart for many reasons. But I think, like you said, there's...

Greg (02:58.27)
Well, and one of the reasons, one of the reasons is your favorite taco shop.

Doug (03:02.513)
My favorite taco shop, Taco and Burrito Place, 40th and Keystone if you haven't been there, highly recommend it. Reached out to try to get a sponsorship for this, but it was a little late in the game. But so unpaid, just pure recommendation there for anybody in Indianapolis. But like I said, there's 21 states that have this out there. There's federal programs, right? There's local programs. I think every two weeks, we're gonna pick a program.

Greg (03:12.234)
Yeah, not yet.

Doug (03:30.225)
And we're going to go through it in detail and cover, you know, how easy is it to apply? How many, how much funds are available? When are the deadlines? What can you even use it for? And I think like most importantly, when we were talking about this organization is like what the impact can be, not just on the employee population, but for the organization as well. And I think that's where it gets really excited. Really exciting, not excited. I'm excited about it. It's exciting to think about those things. And I think, you know,

We'll fold in some parroting topics. Obviously, we work in the space. We have the fortune of being able to run these programs, help get these programs stood up for organizations, and really just try to bring it to the forefront so that everybody can benefit from these resources.

Greg (04:17.042)
Yep. It's, um, it's very similar to what I do in my daily life on the consumer side. So, you know, me like coupons, double couponing. Uh, have you heard of the extension honey? Join honey. I mean, I've saved a ton of, ton of money there. Um, trying to find promo codes. Like the fact that it's out there.

Doug (04:26.285)
Hahaha!

Doug (04:31.513)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Doug (04:40.155)
Does your quest to save lead you to spending more?

Greg (04:45.346)
Probably Yeah, of course, I mean you got if you're gonna go to Costco if you're gonna go to Costco you got to get that 2% back

Doug (04:51.053)
Yeah, well listen, Costco, this is my entire wardrobe right now is Costco at this point, it's part of being a suburban dad.

Greg (04:56.266)
We've already dropped three names and this is the first episode. Um, well, let's jump into the next part, which I do think it'd be interesting to do a stat of the week. So, um, for those that are not familiar, there's a coalition out there organization called Motherly and they launched their 2023 report.

Doug (05:04.895)
Yeah.

Greg (05:18.846)
And once that I found fascinating, 58% of women stated that childcare was the number one reason why they would not return or could not return or had to leave the workforce. So, I mean, that's extremely powerful. If we could be of any help, be an ally, it's giving other organizations and people just the awareness that this exists because I think some HR teams don't.

Doug (05:43.805)
Yeah, absolutely. It's, I mean, we hear it constantly through the organizations we deal with. And, you know, in the past, as I've worked in the HR space is it's hard for people going through that transition, especially first time parents, especially single income households. There's a lot we can do and a lot of resources out there. So without further ado, should we jump into it? All right.

Greg (06:06.726)
Yeah. So we're going to get into Indiana. Indiana actually launched this. I want to say, was it a couple months ago or maybe a couple weeks ago? But I don't, I don't think the awareness of it was.

Doug (06:20.714)
It was announced, but the details of it, I think, really came out late. And it's interesting because the deadline for it, which is tied to the funding source, is December 15. Yeah, that's eight days away. So we're chasing a little bit on this one. But the really nice thing here is it's very expansive. It's easy to apply. Very simple eligibility. So

Greg (06:25.78)
Yeah.

Greg (06:30.914)
to eight days, eight days.

Greg (06:44.338)
Yeah.

Doug (06:47.089)
We're going to go through that in detail. If you're not taking advantage of this already, there's actually still time to get in under the window because it's not going to take a huge lift to get things together.

Greg (06:58.546)
Yep. And if you're just listening to this, we're going to post this as well. So you could watch it because we're going to share our screen. Um, the application, I think is only maybe six pages and there's like maybe five or six questions each on each page. If not, if that, um, and so this one compared to others that we've seen is.

I mean, far better just from the impact that it could have. And we look at impact from who's eligible, like what are they considering eligibility? What can you spend it on? And then just the overall application, like was it easy? In this case, they have a landing page that is segmented by the main questions that you need to know. There was one I read from, you're right.

Doug (07:49.362)
Which you think would be like table stakes in this, but this is actually like the reason why we're shocked by this is most don't have this. So kudos to the state of Indiana for getting that together.

Greg (07:56.406)
Right. Yes. And I believe it was the office of early childhood and out of school learning office. So for each of the state programs, and it could be a state program we're going to talk to, there's grants that are out there. We're going to be focusing specifically on the employer programs.

Doug (08:07.185)
Yep.

Greg (08:19.83)
There's a ton of government programs, but we will not be touching on that side of it. I think we're gonna be focusing on the employer side. So for this one, we gave it a nine out of 10 for impact and a nine out of 10 for ease of application. First episode, biggest score, probably going to be hard to duplicate.

Doug (08:39.801)
It's going to be a while before we get to this level. And I think that's why we wanted to start here, obviously, because of the timeline. But also, this is amazing. And hopefully, more states continue to follow suit with these types of programs.

Greg (08:51.562)
Yep. I think it's, I do see states copying each other. So for example, Michigan, two years ago, started the Tri-Share program.

Doug (09:03.687)
Mm-hmm.

Greg (09:06.298)
It's actually part of this program too, the TriShare. And TriShare, for those that don't know, employer pays 30%, family pays 30%, government pays 30%. That can create a sustainable model. When you're trying to just solve the affordability problem, if everybody chips in 30%, that can actually create a sustainable model. I know other states that are looking at it. I know...

I'm forgetting at the top of my head, but there's several other states that are looking at TriShare and even state of Indiana has it as part of this program. So I think why we why we scored it so high First of all the eligibility employers that have 20 employees qualify and even if you don't have 20 employees you can band together Multiple employers to just get above 20

Doug (09:55.461)
And it's 20 employees in the state of Indiana. So even for a company citist outside of Indiana, if you have 20 or more employees in Indiana, you can apply for this to deliver this to a child care benefit in the state.

Greg (09:58.431)
Yeah.

Greg (10:03.83)
Yep.

Greg (10:08.126)
Yep. Things to keep in mind, it excludes current child care operators, so only businesses. And you have to have a project plan and you have to agree that you're going to contribute at least 10%. So, I mean, that is fair.

Doug (10:15.049)
Mm-hmm.

Doug (10:25.85)
Which, I mean, 10% as we look at, I think Kentucky had a program, I know we've looked at it in Iowa, it's normally what we've seen is closer to a 50% match. So this is actually like a really exciting way. Yeah, it was incredibly reasonable when you look at it, you're gonna put potentially, let's call it $100,000 benefit, right, in to impact your employees, the cost to you is gonna be 10 grand, right? That's the...

Greg (10:34.846)
Yeah, more reasonable.

Greg (10:52.678)
Yeah.

Doug (10:53.105)
Like that is, if you could do that with any benefits program, I think you'd probably jump at it from this side. So let's get into the details of it. Let's talk about where it came from. Let's talk about, yeah, we can go again through the eligibility, but let's talk about what can it be used for, right? Because at the end of the day, we talk about childcare benefits. It's a broad category. Some may be experienced with it, some may not. So I think that's where we can spend a lot of time digging into it.

Greg (11:02.626)
Okay.

Doug (11:22.141)
And but let's talk about where it came from. So Greg, you mentioned this came through the early childhood and out of school learning program, our department in the state of Indiana. And really what it's looking to target is helping, families get consistent childcare, especially when it comes to boosting the workforce, but also just working on access in areas because access is tough.

Greg (11:22.166)
Yeah.

Doug (11:50.369)
Supply and demand is constantly changing. Kids are aging into the school age population. We don't have even universal pre-K set up yet. So what do we do in those areas? And how do we make sure that stat that we talked about for motherly is that people don't have to make that decision. They don't have to turn around and go, I'm not coming back to the workforce. So what this is, the opportunity is for employers to kind of step up and kind of take this role of helping.

Greg (12:07.222)
Yep.

Doug (12:19.833)
support their employees in the workforce, bring those outside of the workforce back into the workforce, by giving a benefit through multiple avenues that we'll go through, that actually helps them afford access childcare. And this is a $25 million innovation grant fund. And so it's there, it's there to be used, we'll go through the caps, but it's an amazing opportunity for employers that are looking to support

not just the workforce, not just their employees, but their communities as well.

Greg (12:54.551)
Yep.

And so this, again, for those that are watching, this is the website. And it actually, again, it's clearly laid out how you're gonna apply. They had webinars that happened, and there's even ones that are on demand. They have a whole section on just the overview, which we just went through, eligibility, the expenses, how to apply, the award amounts, and then a great FAQ section. And so, again, from ease of application and understanding, this has been by far one of the best that I've seen.

Doug (13:09.182)
Mm-hmm.

Greg (13:26.617)
When we look at eligibility, so we mentioned a business or company, 20 employees, or band together, at least 20 in the state of Indiana.

Doug (13:33.513)
Mm-hmm. Yep.

Doug (13:40.089)
Yeah, you gotta get 20 people together through some sort of loose association you can apply for this grant. Also, you know, community-based nonprofits can band together. So very flexible in how this can go into place. And we'll see that the funding amounts are actually tied to the amount of employees. So the more employees you have, the greater the grant that you can be awarded. Well, let's talk about what you can use it for, right? So I think-

Greg (13:45.874)
Yep.

Greg (14:04.574)
Yeah.

Doug (14:07.813)
Almost, if you're a company in Indiana, you're eligible. Right? Let's just say that, right? Business, you have employees, you're eligible. If you don't have 20 employees, go next door, talk to the business next door, get them. You gotta grab three or four. You can apply for this together, right? So it's eligibility, like we're there. Let's talk about what we can use it for. Starting at the top, sponsoring dependent care assistant plans, right? Putting money in a decap.

Greg (14:25.014)
Yep. Sure.

Doug (14:37.981)
You know, there's some limitations here, both in how families use it and how much money you can put in annually where there's no tax consequences, but it is tax advantage for the employee. So, huge value, common thing. Little bit of a barrier to using it, right? Especially when we look at frontline industries. I know from my experience, Greg, I think you can speak to this as well. It's sometimes a little bit harder to understand. You gotta go through the workflow, this reimbursement process.

Which reminds me, my youngest got tubes in his ears today and I need to file an HSA claim and submit my DCAP. But yeah, so like, but again, right? Easy pass through systems in place if you have a DCAP set up today for your employees. Now again, we're kind of through the open enrollment window for a lot of organizations. Is this gonna be the widest like utilized option here?

Greg (15:07.152)
The double dipping, the double dipping like.

Greg (15:14.09)
Yep.

Doug (15:37.463)
But it's here, it's not always on the list.

Greg (15:41.075)
when someone can make this much easier to use it's gonna be so powerful just because for those that don't know on the decap it's pre-tax

So from a household perspective, let's say they contributed $2,500. They're going to deduct that from your adjusted gross income. So you're not paying tax on that. But then on the other side for the employer, you're not going to pay the $7.65 FICA tax. So for every $1,000, you're getting back $76. For every $1,000 that you donate, like imagine that adds up. There's like very little, there's not many other benefits that when you pay for them,

can actually get money back. Like this is one. The next would be providing onsite or near-site childcare. So this would be partnering with somebody down the street in the neighboring community, building an onsite center, supporting your onsite center, again coordinating with local other near-site childcare.

And when we look at this, it says companies provide space and contract with a child care provider to operate the program.

Doug (16:53.965)
Mm hmm. And I think one of the things that calls out there, too, is employers often choose to subsidize tuition costs for priority employee groups. And this is the one thing I've seen across the country. You know, a place builds an on-site center. They don't subsidize the cost and it doesn't affect the employee populations that you're wanting it to affect. Like, to me, like, if you're going to do this, you're going to commit to either it's, you know, a full center dedicated to an employee group.

Greg (17:00.862)
Yes.

Greg (17:16.262)
Yep.

Doug (17:24.093)
or group of employers, or even just seats, subsidizing tuition is almost required for it to make the impact that I think that people want it to have.

Greg (17:36.01)
Yeah, there was, I was recently talking with an employer. They had, I wanna say over 18,000 employees across about seven states. They had two onsite centers, one in Portland and one in Detroit. The Portland one was being pretty well utilized by their employees. The Detroit one, however, was actually used more.

by the community versus the employees at the facility that work there. And part of it is cost. Like an onsite center, especially when you're looking at a entry to mid-level income manufacturing frontline worker, centers, unless you're heavily subsidizing, I just, it's hard.

Doug (18:10.023)
Mm-hmm.

Doug (18:23.433)
I mean, around the country, like you're around $1,200 a month at best, right? You look at somebody working, you know, on a line, an hourly worker making $20 an hour, which doesn't, I mean, historically, you look at minimum wage, they're federally still what, $725, around there, right? Like you think like that's a decent wage. $1,200, that goes fast, right? I mean, that's a significant chunk of their weekly earnings going to childcare.

Greg (18:29.33)
Yeah.

Greg (18:40.83)
Yeah, yeah.

Greg (18:53.014)
Yep. The next area that you can spend on, this one's interesting. I've never actually seen this, but it's creative. So they're basically saying, you can use these funds to establish a priority weightless partnership. And so I think what this would mean, you're the employer.

Doug (19:00.634)
Hahaha

Yeah.

Greg (19:13.406)
You may find some child care providers in the area that have that are already full, but they're on a waitlist You would essentially use your funds to tell them. Hey, i'm gonna like prepay in advance For waitlist fees just so that my employees can get on that program

And so you're helping your employees kind of skip the line and you're paying for it, but you're gonna pay for it through this innovation grant that you're getting. Is that how you're reading it?

Doug (19:28.984)
Mm-hmm.

Doug (19:40.122)
Yeah, I mean, I think that's what I've seen before, right? The challenge here is administration, like who are you partnering with? Like, what are those programs? Are they broad enough? Are they located in the areas? Like, to me, this is, it's a great thing to be able to do, especially for employees, but it needs to be attached to something else. Like, I don't think it's like a fully fleshed out solution. The nice thing here is that it's eligible.

Greg (19:47.178)
Yeah.

Doug (20:05.541)
Right. And that's what we're looking for, because something like this could be part of a solution that you need in an area. You know, can be a way to help support providers, right. Consistency, you know, different types of programs, especially after school programs, you know, they get full, you know, managing the waiting lists, especially if people are becoming first time parents. Infant spaces are always the hardest to get in daycare. So that's.

Greg (20:06.114)
Yeah.

Greg (20:12.702)
Yeah, especially real areas.

Doug (20:32.747)
I see the value in it. I don't think it's a complete option, but it's a good option.

Greg (20:36.043)
Yeah. I just think it's creative, right? Like that normally what I've seen from states is like, it has to be licensed, it has to have four walls and two things, like it was very, very specific. And they excluded a lot of these things like, and so the fact that they recognize that, that they likely have childcare deserts so supply is a problem.

Doug (20:49.103)
Mm.

Greg (20:59.726)
and they know that waitlisting is a big barrier, and so if they can give their employers in the state some advantage, then the funds can be used for that. So I'm reading it.

Doug (21:10.457)
Yeah, you know, as it dug into this, right, like the providers are eligible, it's licensed facilities or programs that are otherwise certified through the state of Indiana. So it means that we're not just focused on licensed daycare facilities and like licensed in-home daycares, right? There are other programs, right, that are certified by the state of Indiana that this can be used for, which again, broad, creative, what you want to see in a program like this to maximize the impact in a short amount of time.

Greg (21:26.87)
Yeah.

Greg (21:39.922)
Yep. Next one is hits at the heart of affordability.

Doug (21:41.771)
Um.

Doug (21:46.929)
Offering tuition benefits. If you want to see an impact, right, we've seen this play out time and again, Greg, right, is help fund childcare. The broadest definition possible. It makes such a big difference. It improves what it does when you focus on the affordability aspect like this, either reimbursing parents directly for care.

or funneling that money directly to providers and subsidizing care. And I would argue the first one's more expensive because most people have some sort of child care set up today. So when you try to force them into a box, you may not be equitable in how people benefit from it. You really wanna give the flexibility in how they can utilize it. But what it does is it allows you to really maximize the use of all available childcare supply in an area.

You know, it wouldn't be eligible for this, but we've seen it, you know, through programs that we've helped stand up, like even leveraging, you know, friends and family network and grandma or aunt or neighbor who's watching a kid in a backup scenario can be an incredibly powerful thing and help bridge that gap. But I mean, this is where it like this component almost needs to be there in some fashion.

Greg (23:00.502)
Yeah.

Doug (23:10.885)
uh... of any program for the truly reach united the impact that we want to see

Greg (23:15.619)
Yeah. Well, I think there was a really great talk from a gentleman that I saw through the bipartisan policy center. His name was Dr. Dolan. And he had talked about when you're looking to solve this problem, there's five areas that you have to consider and in order. So first is

Doug (23:25.522)
Mm-hmm.

Greg (23:39.254)
The next is proximity. So affordability, can my employees afford it on the income that they have? Generally, rural areas, $36,000 a year is reasonable. So can they actually afford the childcare at that income level? The next is proximity. So if they can afford it, is it actually close? And what they found in their research was employees that were traveling an hour to the plant, they told the employer,

Doug (23:48.274)
Mm-hmm.

Greg (24:08.086)
that they'd be willing to drive 15 minutes max outside of their already where they're going. Otherwise it's not gonna work for them. So affordability is number one. Number two is proximity. If you can pay for it and it's close, the next question then the accessibility. So are they open during the times that I need? So if you can afford it and it's close and they meet your hours, the next is availability. Like do they even have spots? So if you can afford it.

Doug (24:15.857)
Yeah.

Doug (24:27.666)
Mm-hmm.

Greg (24:37.95)
It's close, it meets the hours, and then it's open. The last part is quality. So does this match with the quality that my kid deserves? That's gonna help with their learning. And so affordability, like you can't get to quality until you address affordability. So you have to do those in that order. With this one, with the offering tuition benefits, the way that they write it in here,

Doug (24:43.762)
Mm-hmm.

Greg (25:03.454)
It says that in this model, employers set the parameters for how and where employees can use it. And they gave an example. I actually, I'm reading this as that's just one example. There's other ways that they can provide tuition benefits. So it's not just childcare tuition discounts offered for families enrolling in licensed high care programs, right? It could be home daycares.

Doug (25:10.985)
Mm-hmm.

Doug (25:28.413)
Could be home daycares, it could be after school programs. Like there's a lot of flexibility in the wording, digging deeper into the program and the requirements. It really comes back to what I said before, like is it somehow licensed or certified through the state of Indiana? If it is, it's eligible, right? And that's, again, I think one of the most exciting things about this and kind of goes into the next, which is reserving seats in local childcare programs. You know, this is, you know, I think a lot of ways and even when we go down to the next one,

Greg (25:37.964)
Yeah.

Greg (25:44.106)
Yeah.

Doug (25:58.281)
providing backup care options, like they all kind of go hand in hand, right? And this is partnering with centers, home daycares, programs that are eligible in the area. And are you holding a seat so that there is access and availability? That reserved seat could be used for full time care, part time care, you know, it could be subsidized, you know, to the employee. There could be some cost share.

it can be held for backup care, right? So you know that you have a couple spaces available when people's care falls through. Administering these different things can be a challenge, but providers, networks are used to this, right? And standing these things up.

Greg (26:40.536)
Yeah.

Greg (26:44.006)
The next one is really innovative too. Have you read this one? This one, I think, it's interesting. I wonder how it could play out, but the way that the community infrastructure investments, I think this is obviously targeting supply. So supply is an issue. And so what they're saying is, if you the employer qualify, you can actually put some of those funds into a shared fund that other employers invest in.

Doug (26:48.21)
The infrastructure investments. Yeah.

Greg (27:13.7)
going to target basically increasing capacity. So whether that's the creation of a new program, whether that's getting a licensed home daycare from a medium to a large to however they determine their sizing.

Doug (27:17.481)
Hmm.

Greg (27:28.478)
It could be expanding services. It says it could be increasing the provider sustainability, investing in education workforce programs. Like this is insane. And it's a way I think that the, you know, the state of Indiana, they're giving these options. Like this is the one of the most diverse ways you can use funds and it's a grant. So you're not paying this back.

Doug (27:35.93)
Mm.

Doug (27:53.481)
That's great. And I think where we're going to see this come into play is probably more in the nonprofit or community groups, either through a public private partnership, right? Or I think going through the requirements as a public entity can band together, or nonprofit band together can apply for this and then go find the employers to partner with. So they're trying to really push this funding out right and get it in fact, the community, which is amazing.

Greg (28:02.59)
Yeah.

Greg (28:13.395)
Yep.

Greg (28:19.114)
Yeah, I'm going to be interested. Yeah.

Doug (28:19.573)
And so I think that's what that's where we're gonna see that to see to see if that takes hold It's an ambitious thing supply is the hardest thing to address But it's so critical to it. So to have this component there is really exciting

Greg (28:30.603)
Yeah.

Doug (28:37.593)
Um, and then

Greg (28:37.674)
Yep. I'm really interested to see how many people apply. I know there was a couple other states that launched grant programs that they didn't really take off. Like they were calling around to people to say, hey, like this money is available. And I think the feedback was we heard about it, but it was so complex to get to. Like I'm excited to see. I won't name the state right now, but I'm excited to see.

Doug (29:04.927)
And it's okay, I know which one. Yeah.

Greg (29:05.158)
They're going to take another pass at it because a lot of these governors, they're already committing these funds. And every test that I have seen has been successful and they're going back for more funding. It's not like they're not stopping the program. So that's why I think this is exciting. If their floor is 25 million, imagine when this is successful, it's going to double, triple over the next five years.

Doug (29:21.587)
Yeah.

Greg (29:31.547)
Why don't we talk a little bit about the TriShare programs? This one is a little bit more complicated, but it's interesting.

Doug (29:36.205)
Yeah, Tricer is a little bit more complicated. You need something to manage it, right? So it's not something that a single employer is typically going to set up. But, I think if we look at community groups, we look at regionally, Tricer Administrator can come in, and really the goal is, and I think ultimately this is the solution, the path to get there.

I think it is through a lot of these options we've talked about above. But the solution at the end of the day is that the government, the employer and the family each has a stake in, you know, having reliable license child care for those below school age. And so what a Trishare program is, is exactly that. It's a structured way for that to happen.

where a third of the cost falls on the employer, a third of the cost falls on the family, and a third of the cost is coming from the government. The nice thing with this, if you do a tri-share program here, the government's going to basically take 90% of that employer cost, I think through the first funding year with this. And so if you can get it set up, if you have it there, I think it's an amazing way to get into that.

I think probably for the timeline of this, we're not gonna see like a ton of Trishare programs start up or if they are, they're probably well ahead of us on this measure. But I think it's, again, we look at how comprehensive Indiana was at doing a needs assessment and understanding what the state needs, what the workforce needs, what children need, what childcare providers need.

Greg (31:03.51)
Yeah.

Doug (31:22.405)
and really including all of these things shows a lot of forethought and I think bodes well for the future of the state.

Greg (31:30.002)
Yes, I mean, I know that this is a, it's always been a hot topic. And when I've talked with some people.

They always say like, why isn't the government doing anything about this? And I always get to say like, you don't see what I see. Like, this is one of the first times that I can actually see people are saying, like, can you do something about this? And I see funding going to it and I see awards happening. And I see like them not only trying to, like on their first go, they may not have got it right, but they're trying again.

Doug (31:59.494)
Mm.

Greg (32:11.024)
This is actually one of the things that I can personally see and personally say, you know what, there are like given another three to five years, there's going to be a flood of new programs and that'll give us more episodes. Um, one of the other things when we talk about, uh, eligibility, so they have a tiered system. So the max to 750,000.

All the way down to 20 employees and again you can you can combine this with other employers So if you have more than a thousand

Doug (32:39.61)
Yeah, 1,000 employees is that first tier. That's a pretty low hurdle for that top tier from what we've seen.

Greg (32:45.246)
Yeah, I do wonder how many. Yeah, I mean it is. And so if you have 1000 employees, you can get an award cap up to $750,000. That is crazy.

If you have between 500 and 999, that's 350,000. If you have between 250 and 499, 200,000, 100 to 249 is 100,000. 50 to 100 employees is still $50,000. Like let's do a quick exercise here. Okay, Doug. So if you have 99 employees, let's give me a map. 99 employees, let's assume 40% have kids. That's 40%.

Doug (33:13.225)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah. Is this math? Is this gonna be math? This is gonna be math.

Doug (33:27.026)
99 employees can we get? Yeah.

Greg (33:27.498)
Right? So about 40 employees. 40 employees. Because not everybody has kids. And so 40 employees, if you're gonna give them, let's just say, give 250 a week.

Doug (33:33.99)
Right.

Doug (33:40.723)
Mm-hmm.

Greg (33:41.322)
So let's actually just do a little bit, 125 a week times 12. You can give all 40 employees $125 a month. It's about 60,000. So you pay 10,000. The government's paying 50,000. So this is getting 40 of your employees, $125 a month. That's gonna be at least 10, 15% maybe of their cost. But this is like free money. You just gotta fill out the application.

Doug (33:46.193)
Yeah.

Doug (33:52.765)
Yep.

Doug (34:05.187)
Mm.

Yeah, it's there. And again, that tuition coverage, like this is what we're going to do. This is the impact. So I think, and quickly, I know we're going to get into the application. A couple of things in researching this. If you have multiple locations in the state of Indiana, you can apply separately, or you can apply joint. You can't do both. But you can look at that. So if you're a student, you can apply

Greg (34:32.782)
Mm-hmm.

Doug (34:36.113)
one location and you want to put something like this in place for your one location, like that is a way to do it. It doesn't have to be completely organization wide and those same thresholds apply.

Greg (34:44.313)
Yep.

Greg (34:48.066)
Yep. And again, for those that are watching, this is basically the application process. You're going to log in, access the grant portal, you're going to review eligibility, which we already talked about. You're going to select your application tracks. So they have a group application and then a single employer. So if you're multiple employers, you're going to go for the group application. If you're just a single employer, you're going to do the single and then it's going to ask some questions. So the there's three, there's about

Doug (34:59.77)
Mm-hmm.

Doug (35:16.005)
Six, yeah, eight sections, six questions on this page. Really just basic organization information here and what childcare benefits that are in place today. Probably take you about three and a half minutes to answer these six questions. I did not time that specifically, but that's my scientific estimate at this point.

Greg (35:17.04)
Thanks.

Greg (35:41.262)
Right. Yeah, I think probably a little more than three and a half minutes only because, you know, there's like, here's one example of a question. Describe the barriers that prevent you from offering or expanding child care benefits to meet the needs of your Indiana based workforce. Easy answer. I don't have the, I don't have the budget. Yeah.

Doug (35:56.287)
Cost. Cost! I don't have the budget approval for this. Cost, right? Next one. Ha ha ha.

Greg (36:01.99)
Easy. Next one. Describe child care benefits you currently offer to your Indiana-based workforce. None because of... yeah. Please share the methods currently used to collect and monitor your Indiana-based workforce child care needs. I mean, you probably don't because... yeah.

Doug (36:10.057)
What the hell is this?

Doug (36:19.233)
Employ internal surveys probably yeah word of mouth You know, I mean I will say yeah could be pulse surveys, right? Things like that, but it's probably not much beyond that some time in attendance if it gets to a level of regularity

Greg (36:31.348)
Yeah.

Greg (36:35.398)
Estimated percentage of Indiana-based workforce with children ages 0 to 12. Here's the thing, you go into your HRIS system and you just filter and you say, hey, show me employees that are on my medical plan with dependents. It can give you the number, pretty easy. They also say estimate.

Doug (36:52.709)
Yeah, with dependents. Yeah, you don't have a, and if you don't have that, it says estimate, take your workforce, right? I think the national average rate is around 33%. I have children under the age of 12.

multiplication and we're there. Three and a half minutes. Bug it.

Greg (37:09.43)
Done. Next page. Next page, what's your legal name? Street, like easy stuff. There is nothing here, primary contact, easy. Next page, allowable expense categories. Yes, if you're looking at this.

Doug (37:16.421)
Yeah.

Yep.

Doug (37:23.842)
These are checkboxes. Yeah. These are checkboxes. Yeah.

Greg (37:28.346)
And you're going to check, you know, does it say carefully review? You may only select one category. That's interesting. That's fine. Choose a offering tuition benefits. That would be the best, but you know, there are some other interesting ones here, but tuition benefits easy.

Doug (37:41.657)
If you have a plan, you know what you want to do, pick that one. If you're not sure, but you want to help your employees, click Tuition Benefits.

Greg (37:45.492)
Yeah.

Greg (37:49.938)
Yeah. Next is complete the request for funding page. Describe how you propose to use the funds. And here's the thing, this is funny. Responses are limited to 2000 characters. They don't want you to, like, they wanna make this easy. Yeah, I know.

Doug (37:59.975)
Mm-hmm.

Doug (38:04.793)
Somebody has to read these, right? Like, I mean, at the end of the day, the window closes the 15th, it's in eight days, right? There are plenty, yeah, like get it in, make it brief. I mean, these are things that like even, you know, like one of our customers come to us, Greg, we would do this with them, right? Like we would fill this out. Like there's support out there. I mean, just quickly, they're done, we're out the door.

Greg (38:11.934)
Yeah, so get going. That's.

Greg (38:25.887)
Yeah, one session.

Greg (38:31.902)
Yeah, if anybody wants a little help, you can reach out to Doug or myself.

Doug (38:37.873)
Yeah, we'll do it with you. Yep.

Greg (38:38.538)
The next step eight provide a project budget. Okay, this Seems pretty straightforward. So if you're offering like it calculates it for you Literally you put in, you know indicate the total percent your of your total grant that you request is paid out For the receipt of approved implementation plan. So it's like hey when I submit the implementation plan, give me 30%

Doug (39:02.726)
Yep.

Greg (39:03.118)
If you're asking for 100,000, give me 30,000 when I submit a plan. Like, and that's going to be important. Like you're going to need to think about this, but it's a project plan. And it's not like everything that they're saying here is like, um, you know, we're, we're not like, there's no eagle eyes on it, meaning like they understand. Um, and they're, they're asking for estimates. They're asking for project plans. Like they don't, I don't think they're going to expect people to be.

Doug (39:10.536)
Yeah.

Doug (39:30.533)
Project plans estimates the 10% that's asked to be cost shared to the employer. It doesn't need to be pre-funded upfront, right? It needs to be tracked through the time, and the funds need to be used within 12 months. So we're really looking at a year that you're pushing this in place. So it's bracketed and again.

Greg (39:30.922)
you know.

Greg (39:42.43)
Yeah.

Greg (39:51.038)
Yeah.

Doug (39:55.661)
you know, doesn't have to be absolutely down to a T. I think the more comprehensive, compelling it is, great. But at the same time, like, one of the benefits of being like, we're doing tuition benefits is that's pretty streamlined, right, like how that's gonna function.

Greg (40:01.852)
Yeah.

Greg (40:10.734)
Step nine, upload letters of support. So it says letters of support are optional. Again, how easy? Like you definitely should consider, and I think it'll make your application stand out. And it says it may include letters from senior executives, childcare providers, or other businesses supporting the plan. But it also says if you do not wish to include any, just click next. Then you agree to the terms. The terms are you're certifying that this is the best of your ability.

Doug (40:15.482)
Mm-hmm.

Doug (40:31.229)
Hit next. Yep.

Doug (40:38.409)
There's six bullets. I've been.

Greg (40:41.044)
Six bullets that you click yes to And then it'll let actually so here's the harder part. Then you got to review it step 11 and then you click submit on every page of this application, they have a support email and They have a local child care resource and referral agency that you can reach out to get help as well I mean, this is one of the most organized Yeah

Doug (40:43.89)
Yeah.

Doug (41:04.005)
Or yell at us. I mean, like, yeah, we'll walk through it. I mean, this is, again, like, this needs to get used. We want to see this get used, right? And it's all the resources there.

Greg (41:12.938)
Yes, we want to we want to hear we want to hear them say it is all gone and We're gonna get more

Um, so that is the Indiana program. That's how you apply. That's eligibility. Um, I think, I think we should start wrapping it up here. Um, we went over the, the award amounts. It's pretty significant. Again, if you have a thousand employees or more, 750,000 is your cap. And it says once you submit, if you get approved and you submit a plan, the implementation plan, that's 30% you can get up front. You can

Doug (41:33.225)
Yeah.

Greg (41:52.464)
$25,000 by doing the plan and submitting it and you can get moving on this

Doug (41:59.837)
It could be out the door impacting your families by the time we hit January 1st. You could announce it over the holidays. Like this is such a no-brainer to go and put something in place that's going to impact them. You know, I think where there's pushback, we've had conversations, it's like, well, the funding's for one year. And I think the one thing, Greg, you and I can speak to is when you put a program in this in place and you see the impact.

Greg (42:06.634)
Yep.

Doug (42:28.109)
you'd happily take on 100% of that cost the next year because the ROI is immense. It makes such a difference in the community, to your workforce, it impacts turnover, absenteeism, reduces time to hire, helps you open up talent pools, get people back and work, like all of these things, it's amazing. I can't, but you said we're gonna wrap it up. So we're gonna wrap it up. Things we'll dive into as we keep going down this path and making more episodes of this, assuming anybody watches this one.

Greg (42:45.09)
Keep going, keep going, keep going. Well.

Greg (42:58.258)
Yeah, watch or listen.

Doug (43:00.577)
No.

Greg (43:02.926)
However, there is the FAQ section, which has actually a lot more questions. And I just saw one. How will applications be reviewed and scored? This is interesting. Applications will be reviewed based on criteria, including, but not limited to, how they prioritize support for vulnerable family populations, indicate local partnerships and engagement, and offer a plan for sustainability. So when you're filling this out, keep this in mind. At the end of the day, if you're an employer that's in a rural area,

Doug (43:26.642)
Mm-hmm.

Greg (43:32.68)
you're a vulnerable population. Like this is it's designed to help support our vulnerable populations. It also there's all these other questions that it answers. So how long is how long do I have to spend the money and funds can be used to cover costs incurred up to 12 months after the award is received. That is crazy.

Does it is it considered income so it says yes any awards are considered income and you'll get a 1099 for it, but The OECO SL they don't provide tax advice nor do we But you're gonna get a 1099 but listen, I mean you're getting

Doug (44:11.437)
We don't provide that kind of tax advice. We talk about these programs. But yeah, yeah.

Greg (44:15.07)
Yeah, exactly. Still worth it, even if you're going to have to, even if it's going to be taxed. Keep that in mind, though, in your budget. So when you are doing your budget, keep in mind the tax implications. I think that's it, Doug. I think we nailed it on the first one. I think Indiana was a great way to start this one. It has been one of the best that I've seen over the last three years.

Doug (44:40.141)
If this pops up at every state, it changes like everything, I think, for working parents in the country. So again, right, big shout out to the Hoosier State for getting this in place. For anybody who's tagged along this long, like we said, if you need help, you can reach out to us, reach out to support us, state of Indiana, right? The local resources that are available, but get this in place, make an impact, follow the state along on their journey. And it's great.

Greg (45:09.994)
hear the outro music. Thank you everybody, we'll see you in a couple weeks. Bye.

Doug (45:16.209)
Yep.